Re: IFCA Series News

by **IFCA GTDon** Wed Sep 30, 2020 5:26 pm

D1mien wrote:I have not fully read all of the stipulations for the grudge match series but as for the week ban penalty perhaps it can be worked around to be for the grudge match series. Say that a driver loses he is then not available to be used in the the next few grudge match races forcing the team to be better at negotiation before hand so you still have high stakes but nobody is really out of forza for and extended time. Again I have not fully read all the rules and things about this series. This is just a simple quick glance from the statement above.

Thanks for the inquiry D1mein. Yes, this has been a topic of debate which tells me it is a valuable exchange with an equivalency to money in a way. We can't race for money or pinks or anything of physical value but we can tie a cost to losses that works about the same as using cash.

Our provision for this feature is to allow the Club leaders to decide who will be sacrificed and pay the price of a loss rather than the actual driver who lost. In this way it is a lot more flexible and strategic. It helps with drivers who need to be able to be on Forza to race at another league for example.

The outline for the format (which is still evolving) is here:
https://ifca.forumotion.com/t6686-ifca-club-grudge-match-format-leader-board

by **IFCA GTDon** Thu Oct 01, 2020 11:05 am

I was recently asked, if someone was to join a club would they have to race? If the Club Grudge Match series was more like an endurance team with all sorts of jobs available from pit crew to painters to engineers, the answer would be yes. But being a part of a racing team or a club in the case of the Club Grudge Match series is for the primary purpose of racing. This means that everyone has to be open and available to accept a "Call Out" from another club even if you are more of a painter or just want to be a tester.

You see, if you haven't figured it out yet, in order for this to actually work there has to be a minimum number of even number drivers and clubs. That way every club will have a match every week, and every driver will have an opponent every week even when some members may not be eligible to race.

Because there is a limited minimum and maximum driver roster of between 4-6 drivers per club, everyone has to be a racer first and foremost. Still, chances are very good that out of an 8 week season each member will race not more than 2 times on average. Why? Because if you win you have to sit on the bench for a week. If you lose, someone has to be picked to stay off Forza a whole week. Only eligible drivers will be "Called Out" and only eligible drivers will be issuing "Call Outs" through their club leaders. This means that only about half of any clubs roster will be available to race each week. This is why you have to have at least 4 drivers to create a viable club, because each weekly match is 2 races. You can't actually compete week to week with less than 4 drivers is the point.

Beyond this statistical requirement, there is room for people to add to their club's identity and effort by doing things they are better at like painting or testing or tuning. Everyone in the club can carve out a place that they can be a big help in supporting the club and bringing a positive spirit to. Like any club or team or group esprit de corps is essential for success be it in sports, the military, or family. Setting a goal and creating a belonging or brotherhood of association inspires people to reach for higher levels which in turn advances the club closer to their goal of winning.

Members of a club can really get into this and make a difference and reap the reward of winning that they could not otherwise do on their own is the deeper point. It enables people to aspire to greater achievement that is all but impossible without the support of like-minded members. And this is where the unity of purpose and shared challenges become an unstoppable force multiplier.

For those of you who are veterans like me you know the power and strength of this philosophy. It is the core reason Army Rangers were able to scale the 100ft cliffs of Pointe du Hoc under heavy German machinegun fire during the WWII D-Day invasion. Or why US Marines were able to raise the flag on Mt Suribachi on Iwo Jima.

The point is, when you are of one mind working together there is nothing that can't be achieved. Place this mindset in the context of sports or in this case simulation racing and you get to feel the same kind of exhilaration that comes from being part of a group with a purpose. The urgency and effort is amplified and with it the glory. Have a bunch of groups with this club spirit all competing in the same way, and it gets really crazy and fun.

by **IFCA GTDon** Fri Oct 09, 2020 6:47 am

If you haven't checked out the cars and tracks and details for the 2nd Annual IFCA Triple Crown on Oct 24th you probably should. Of particular note is the lifting of the Factory rating dividing line to 1958.999. This should help supply plenty of Factory eligible drivers. As you all know you have to have at least 1 on your 3 man team.

Go here:
https://ifca.forumotion.com/t6690-2nd-annual-ifca-triple-crown-oct-24th

by **IFCA GTDon** Sat Oct 10, 2020 3:23 pm

Several people both friendly and unfriendly to the idea of a Club Grudge match have independently pointed out to me that clubs will rely exclusively on OP leaderboard cars to beat people with. That even though we are requiring the cars to have full-width racing slicks and no downforce parts, and a random P.I., people will still be able to grab any leaderboard car and simply transfer the tune on an upgraded build. And because of this, the series will still be nothing but a leaderboard car competition.

Even if this were true wouldn't that be more equal for everyone I ask you? Everyone has access to the same leaderboard cars. The only difference would be in the specific build and tune which can vary a lot and still be competitive.

Well, as I was noticing some people preaching against doing Club Grudge racing based on this unproven opinion, I thought I might be able to find out if it is really true or not by doing some test laps. It turns out that it definitely isn't as cut and dry as it was being sold. The leaderboard cars I tested in both A-Class and B-Class were #1 cars at the track I went to. The A-Class car was dominant but had at least 1 other car that was competitive. But over in B-Class at the same track, there was a lot more diversity and less dominance.

In the A-Class test I ran the two top cars and then selected 3 non-leaderboard cars to compare. All the cars were Club Grudge regulation spec with widest slicks and no downforce and were built towards power like a leaderboard car or public lobby car without clutches, flywheels, brakes, etc.

Not surprisingly the #1 leaderboard car proved to be the slowest by a lot. It was way off the pace by nearly 3sec. The #2 best leaderboard car was faster than the #1 car and practically tied with the other 3 tested cars which are not in the top 100 on rivals for this particular track.

You might ask why this would be and the simple answer is that leaderboard cars often have very specialized builds. Once you radically change the builds they can lose a lot of their original dominance. And that's what we have here. The #1 car is built with stock tires and stock width, with mega hp, and downforce, and the fast guys still have to use TCS to keep them on the road.

But then I thought what if you bring a #1 leaderboard car from a lower class, up a class, how would it do? Would it be even more dominant or what? Turns out it does pretty well but still loses its dominance.

From this testing, it tells me that the fear that only leaderboard cars will be in play or that they will remain OP is unfounded. At best they are good cars with equal performance to non-leaderboard cars. Altering the builds to conform to our specs dramatically reduces their performance and brings them in line with the upper half of the non-leaderboard cars.

Another factor that isn't measured in this debate is the negotiation when calling out another club. Let's say I'm wrong and the #1 car in the class at the track picked is still somewhat faster than any other car by like 0.5sec per lap. And let's say you are calling out a slower driver knowing you are going to have to give a time and P.I. handicap. Let's say with a P.I. of A636 you offer a 4sec head start and -10 P.I., but they counter with a 6sec start and a -20 P.I. for your car. You then counter agree to 5sec and 15 P.I. bringing your P.I. down to A621. You show up in the #1 car but they show up in a car that is at least 0.5sec per lap slower when in equal P.I.. The problem is you gave them a 5sec head start when you can only afford a 2sec headstart in the 4lap race. Worse yet, your car is 15 P.I. slower! You can still defeat the slower driver, but having that leaderboard car you are so sure of really didn't make it a slam dunk for you. And this is only if I'm wrong! If I'm right and leaderboard cars are not dominant then you'll have an even bigger problem come race day. lol

Don't get me wrong, the leaderboard cars are usually always good, but this format removes the guaranteed dominance they normally do have. You'll have to try a few non-leaderboard cars like I did to see what might be as good or in fact better. It opens up the entire car list anew which is what we want. Drivers won't be able to automatically go right to their favorite leaderboard/public lobby car. They will have to enlist the aid of their club members and do some searching and testing. And people will have different opinions as to what's best for their taste. Not everyone drives every car equally well.

by **IFCA GTDon** Wed Oct 14, 2020 2:15 pm

Last night a long time Forza friend of mine sort of took me aside to explain human nature and what he thought were the concerns of many regarding the future Club Grudge format. One of those issues was to do with leaderboard cars or outlaw cars.

He understood the provision that all cars were to be limited to the widest racing tires and no downforce. And while he thought that this would help to balance regular cars vs OP cars depending on the track, he thought it was still too enticing for clubs to use OP cars. He also understood that each race was a negotiated race where clubs would have to offer or accept handicaps on headstart times and P.I. He liked that feature a lot but said it wasn't enough to persuade people from using leaderboard cars still.

His point was that competitive human nature would force clubs to always gravitate toward the leaderboard cars over regular cars because they will still perform as well or better on most tracks. I thought about this and tended to agree with him and thought that a solution to make regular cars not only equal but more attractive to use was in order.

When I look at the leaderboards there are just a few cars in each class that dominate at most tracks. When they don't dominate they still do fairly well. These same #1 cars do not dominate at every track, however.

For example, the Donkervoort GTO, Lotus 340R, Lotus Elise, Esprit, and Elise GT1, Ferrari F50, Alfa Romeo 33S, Dodge Vipers, GT40s, Porsche 906, are all the dominant cars in S-Class. Depending on the track one of these dozen or so cars is at the top. Some of these cars are at the top at a lot of tracks, but none are at the top at all of the tracks. In fact, there are quite a few tracks that show there isn't a single dominant car to go with. These tracks tend to be longer speed tracks.

So what's the solution? If you take out the top 3-5 cars at each track it doesn't really solve the problem it just slides down to the next dominant car. Many tracks don't even have a dominant car either. On the other hand at some tracks there is only 1 dominant car and the rest are a distant 2nd.

As a rule most of the very dominant cars in every class fall on the side of grip/handling and acceleration. So it isn't a case of making normal cars faster to keep up, it's a case of making them handle better. The only smart way to do this is to allow regular cars to have downforce parts and be lighter was our conclusion.

But the next question becomes what defines a "regular car?" From looking at the leaderboards it appears that once you get out of the top 50 you start to see a variety of non-leaderboard cars show up. So, we are going to implement a new rule for the format called the "Top 50 rule." If a club shows up with a leaderboard car that is in the top 50 on the designated track of the week, their opponent will have the option to add Forza downforce parts and lightest wheels to the designated and/or negotiated P.I. These parts additions will add as much or more than 5 P.I. to a non-top 50 car. More importantly, it will allow a regular non-leaderboard car to compete equally well against any leaderboard car. A club doesn't have to say what car they are using during their negotiation, only whether or not they are going to use a top 50 car.

So this is how it could look: Let's say the track of the week is Alps Festival and the P.I. is going to be S743. And let's say club Voodoo has an expert Alps Festival Gold level driver they would like to use to call out Silver level driver GTDon from club Ricky Bobby.

Club Voodoo decides they are going to use the #1 leaderboard car on that track in S-Class which is hands down the Lotus Elise GT1 by far. That's the good news for them, the bad news is that in order to get the GT1 down to a S743 they are going to have to strip it down all the way because it just so happens it can't be built any lower than an S743.

Meanwhile, club Ricky Bobby has decided to use a regular car that is not in the top 50 at Alps Festival. In fact, it may not be the best car they could have gone with. They have picked the 2002 Corvette ZO6 and are allowed to build the car to the S743 P.I. with stock wheels, and then, add the lightest wheels and Forza downforce parts. It only gives the Vette 1 more P.I. but it does make the Vette 12lbs lighter with better handling and braking.

Club Voodoo offers a mere 3sec headstart and club RB counters with a full 6sec headstart but Voodoo isn't all that confident and will only give up a 4sec head start in spite of having the best car and one of the best drivers. Club Ricky Bobby would ask for Voodoo to lower their P.I. by 15 but the car Voodoo picked is already as low as it can possibly go, so they ask for a 5sec head start, which Voodoo agrees to.

Here are the stats prior to the race:

	Elise GT1	Corvette ZO6
P.I.	S743	S744
hp/tq	350/295	463/457
weight	2513lbs	2724lbs
120mph Lat Gs	1.62	1.43
1/4 mile	12.067	11.933
Best lap time	1:47.016	1:47.116

As you can see the raw stats are very close with a slight edge to the Elise. Even more of an edge with a superior driver. But what were the terms agreed to? Voodoo agreed to give RB a 5sec head start in a 4lap race. That means Voodoo must make up more than 0.8sec per lap when their car is only between 0.1 and 0.8sec faster depending on the drivers. It can probably be done but catching and then getting around a car is another question especially in such a short race. Even harder when the faster car is in the lead. You'll catch him in the corners, but he will pull away on the straights. This means the faster car can hold you up a bit because you can't get the drive out of the corners you need.

Of course, this is just one of many hypothetical scenarios. Everything changes depending on the designated track and P.I., drivers and negotiations. What this illustrates is that you'll need to consider a variety of factors and that it isn't an easy slam dunk to simply grab a leaderboard car and expect an automatic win because of it. Being in a leaderboard car is no guaranteed win when you have to face a regular car that is allowed downforce and lighter wheels. Add to this the negotiated handicaps whatever they may be and you probably got yourself a real race regardless of your skill level.

by **IFCA GTDon** Wed Oct 21, 2020 4:53 pm

Several drivers have mentioned that it might be easier to first organize this format as an individual driver's match to get people used to the parameters and how things work. Then, after people figure out the process, move to the next step of forming clubs for team competition.

This sounds like sage advice at this point. Easier to manage, easier to recruit for, and easier to challenge your friends with. It may be a better way to get more people involved too. For example, let's say you want to Call Out someone who doesn't race in the IFCA, this would be a fun way to introduce them to the format. Let's say they say, "Nah, it's not for me bro, I'll pass." Then we can place their name on a list of inactive drivers who refuse to compete so people know not to waste time challenging them or calling them out for a 1 on 1 race. We can call it the Pussies list! lol

by **IFCA GTDon** Mon Oct 26, 2020 7:16 pm

After putting together a tentative list of the most active rated drivers in all of Forza we have nearly 60 pairings! The list isn't finalized just yet but it is showing a lot of great match-ups for the first round.

The pairings are mostly semi-random based on ratings where we pair a faster driver with a slower driver. At the same time, we had to handpick some of the match-ups to round things out evenly.

The opponent you end up with is not as important as your agreed to terms with them. You can be up against a strong Gold level driver, but properly negotiated with all the handicap options available to a Bronze or even Tin level driver, and you will still have the equality needed for an exciting close race.

*Please understand, we know without a doubt many of these drivers especially those who aren't aware of this series will have a myriad of excuses for why they can't or won't find the time it takes to run 4laps against you. (it's only 8 minutes out of their entire week)

Many will say in a very whiny feminine voice, "I don't have the time, or, it's not my cup of tea, or, I don't like the open format of picking my own car, build, and time to race, or I don't race in this or that Class, or, I don't like the track, or I don't think it's fair that a faster driver should have to give a slower driver a head start, or I don't race anymore, or I'm not going to be around for the next few weeks, or I don't like my opponent, or, I only race in my own league, or there isn't anything in it for me, or I'm just not interested," or whatever.

The truth is 99% will be excuses not to compete. It's what is known as "pussing out." And for that reason, we will transfer their name as a matter of record-keeping to our "pussies list" of drivers. That way we won't keep humiliating their manhood by challenging them to compete. So don't be that guy. lol

by **IFCA GTDon** Sat Oct 31, 2020 2:46 pm

GTDon2 wrote:After putting together a tentative list of the most active rated drivers in all of Forza we have nearly 60 pairings! The list isn't finalized just yet but it is showing a lot of great match-ups for the first round.

The pairings are mostly semi-random based on ratings where we pair a faster driver with a slower driver. At the same time, we had to handpick some of the match-ups to round things out evenly.

The opponent you end up with is not as important as your agreed to terms with them. You can be up against a strong Gold level driver, but properly negotiated with all the handicap options available to a Bronze or even Tin level driver, and you will still have the equality needed for an exciting close race.

*Please understand, we know without a doubt many of these drivers especially those who aren't aware of this series will have a myriad of excuses for why they can't or won't find the time it takes to run 4laps against you. (it's only 8 minutes out of their entire week)

Many will say in a very whiny feminine voice, "I don't have the time, or, it's not my cup of tea, or, I don't like the open format of picking my own car, build, and time to race, or I don't race in this or that Class, or, I don't like the track, or I don't think it's fair that a faster driver should have to give a slower driver a head start, or I don't race anymore, or I'm not going to be around for the next few weeks, or I don't like my opponent, or, I only race in my own league, or there isn't anything in it for me, or I'm just not interested," or whatever.

The truth is 99% will be excuses not to compete. It's what is known as "pussing out." And for that reason, we will transfer their name as a matter of record-keeping to our "pussies list" of drivers. That way we won't keep humiliating their manhood by challenging them to compete. So don't be that guy. lol

Pairings Rnd 1 @ Road America, Class S750, Nov 14th-15th

Driver	Rating	Skill level
WIL Harmonic	2485.146	Platinum
LZR Diablo	2389.603	Gold

CoD3Pro Brizzho	2434.815	Platinum
RZM McQueen	2304.264	Gold

sameole24	2039.522	Gold
APX COLONEL	1996.373	Silver

IX Morbid XI	2025.734	Gold
Midnite Rider	1958.406	Bronze

CRC Skitchin	2018.277	Gold
FRB JcCarr	1956.161	Bronze

Ax4x Big Ben	2015.523	Gold
AFlamingCoconut	1991.426	Silver

ESV Kartz	2011.473	Gold
VNX Dribblez	1993.569	Silver

FRB M1les	2011.389	Gold
Fire Oranges	1994.402	Silver

SP33D RAC3R 28x	1990.205	Silver
Ducky328i	1981.128	Silver

IslamIsPeace001	2010.398	Gold
D1mien	1991.810	Silver

inviseco	2006.756	Gold
I Deltic I	1986.554	Silver

IR Stiggles	2005.7	Gold
LMP Bubz	1981.596	Silver

StatedF1	2003.765	Gold
DjProfessorK72	1987.646	Silver

R2P Tak	2020.000	Gold
AAR OneShot	1978.634	Silver

LSEM LAWRENCE	2017.454	Gold
FRB NWThumbs	1986.839	Silver

VM MuZz	2002.843	Gold
IllRattlesnake	1975.667	Silver

ROSCOEpCOTRAIN	2006.97	Gold
FAA Orion	1927.648	Bronze

Echovelocity	1986.545	Silver
VNX Shift	1972.141	Silver

MaddogJP	1986.250	Silver
RANGEMASTER	1957.557	Bronze

Zach The One	1986.370	Silver
SimR Sclippy96	1983.896	Silver

DinoGrumps	2011.254	Gold
APX TREMEC	1960.555	Silver

PedanticSquirel	1998.948	Silver
Latte Speed	1976.579	Silver

KickRocks29	1979.947	Silver
SevenZero TA	1957.501	Bronze

ZHP 2004	1974.385	Silver
UDP Senger	1957.097	Bronze

ApoloXxXCreedXx	1972.260	Silver
whoAREyoulamME	1955.347	Bronze

ThatGuyRacing	1971.807	Silver
EarnedCarrot925	1954.928	Bronze

Ball325	1969.86	Silver
ALL MAX RPM	1946.404	Bronze

HNT Awesome	1968.537	Silver
MAD KIWI 22	1949.101	Bronze

Percynimz	1966.145	Silver
yankeesfanfp1	1956.829	Bronze

Flyin Mikey J	1963.345	Silver
FRB Curve	1951.861	Bronze

GTDon2	1962.312	Silver
MrGRiMP	1951.047	Bronze

NFR Troybilt65	1962.177	Silver
Lanrell21	1945.595	Bronze

V8Vance	1961.888	Silver
NFR Yearwood	1945.88	Bronze

VNX Vision	1961.760	Silver
Poennaninova	1956.347	Bronze

FRB Psymon	1961.655	Silver
EZT Baby Hueys59	1937.254	Bronze

EZT TomCat7	1955.183	Bronze
ROGBOW	1945.359	Bronze

SimR Boo3853	1930.545	Bronze
HCCR LT DHAN	1899.643	Tin

UNR Grim	1961.172	Silver
FRB Diesel	1954.027	Bronze

Ridin Sideways	1948.597	Bronze
DRR Brian72nyli	1938.178	Bronze

FRB Incognito	1954.555	Bronze
Animemetalhead	1934.573	Bronze

GR Redneck	1960.458	Silver
SirKane2	1953.543	Bronze

D0CT0R LOL	1960.128	Silver
AlignedCelery36	1950.050	Bronze

FRB DDoZeRR	1952.839	Bronze
SPEEDYJAB09	1943.127	Bronze

STAFFY9000	1959.931	Silver
Thunders29	1943.874	Bronze

GoSox2000	1959.574	Silver
CBR Pacman66	1924.987	Bronze

Papa creech172	1952.600	Bronze
OneslowZZ	1936.627	Bronze

FRB Rustic	1951.622	Bronze
DRR Gato	1944.903	Bronze

Electrickery11	1950.893	Bronze
FRB Danomilano	1937.262	Bronze

FRB Routine	1949.647	Bronze
FSCC Fatal	1941.656	Bronze

FRB Routine	1949.647	Bronze
HCCR RABIDUS	1908.814	Bronze

FRB Powell	1949.379	Bronze
BrosephBennison	1945.182	Bronze

swankyierOrc	1949.142	Bronze
OnaBreak	1924.622	Bronze

FRB RedRum	1949.021	Bronze
VdubzkiKazz	1920.877	Bronze

FRB Unfathomed	1948.374	Bronze
NFR VicVega	1920.902	Bronze

FRB MANoMARS	1947.96	Bronze
Sir John Raptor	1916.796	Bronze

E1ite PandaPool	1991.415	Silver
NellyDRacer	1945.513	Bronze

SWOOP36	1943.879	Bronze
CBR SSlade em	1906.366	Bronze

FRB DaddyCool	1943.52	Bronze
HCCR RedDragon	1921.986	Bronze

CrisCrossAplsos	1943.258	Bronze
ENS Typick	1923.702	Bronze

UNR The Bomber	1942.408	Bronze
FAA LuGnUtZ86	1924.849	Bronze

by **IFCA GTDon** Fri Nov 13, 2020 1:46 am

From talking with some guys both in and out of the IFCA Grudge Match it became apparent that not everyone understands how to be competitive in this format. That is, they are unaware that the format is somewhat "freestyle" in its restrictions, and is designed for you the competitors to decide what is fair within certain limits.

Our Grudge Match race is setup to mirror what takes place in an actual street race. Obviously, there are a few of you out there who have no idea what a street race is or have never seen one.

In illegal street racing, you have to haggle or bargain with your rival for when the race will happen, who gets lane choice, possible car lengths, and cash on the line. It's a money race, so you want the best possible terms you can get.

In our version, there is no money on the line, only rating points and season points. But the motivation should be the same. You want the most favorable conditions for you. This is so because like in a real street race you don't know for a fact if the guy is faster than you. You might have an idea of how fast he is based on what his car looks like but you can't tell for sure, especially if you have never raced him before.

In our case, we have the IFCA ratings to go by which aren't perfectly accurate at times and only give you something to go by if you don't know your opponent. And, you won't know what car he is using until race day usually.

If you are up against a guy with a much higher rating than you it doesn't help you to not ask for a headstart and some P.I.. It won't help you to simply agree to be in the same exact car either.

These pairings are largely random and without regard for equality is why. You have to create the equality between you and your opponent based on what you know. If you know he is faster than you, then by all means you have to ask for a headstart! You'd be stupid not to! You might even ask for his car to be less P.I. too. This doesn't mean he has to accept your offer but it means he has to counter with some kind of handicap just to be fair.

Good luck!

by **IFCA GTDon** Mon Nov 16, 2020 10:52 am

GTDon2 wrote:From talking with some guys both in and out of the IFCA Grudge Match it became apparent that not everyone understands how to be competitive in this format. That is, they are unaware that the format is somewhat "freestyle" in its restrictions, and is designed for you the competitors to decide what is fair within certain limits.

Our Grudge Match race is setup to mirror what takes place in an actual street race. Obviously, there are a few of you out there who have no idea what a street race is or have never seen one.

In illegal street racing, you have to haggle or bargain with your rival for when the race will happen, who gets lane choice, possible car lengths, and cash on the line. It's a money race, so you want the best possible terms you can get.

In our version, there is no money on the line, only rating points and season points. But the motivation should be the same. You want the most favorable conditions for you. This is so because like in a real street race you don't know for a fact if the guy is faster than you. You might have an idea of how fast he is based on what his car looks like but you can't tell for sure, especially if you have never raced him before.

In our case, we have the IFCA ratings to go by which aren't perfectly accurate at times and only give you something to go by if you don't know your opponent. And, you won't know what car he is using until race day usually.

If you are up against a guy with a much higher rating than you it doesn't help you to not ask for a headstart and some P.I.. It won't help you to simply agree to be in the same exact car either.

These pairings are largely random and without regard for equality is why. You have to create the equality between you and your opponent based on what you know. If you know he is faster than you, then by all means you have to ask for a headstart! You'd be stupid not to! You might even ask for his car to be less P.I. too. This doesn't mean he has to accept your offer but it means he has to counter with some kind of handicap just to be fair.

Good luck!

Follow up:

After round 1 was over it became painfully clear that a large percentage of drivers haven't quite caught on to the format yet. What I mean is a lot of drivers had yet to see the need to negotiate terms for a more competitive race. They for some reason simply assumed that a heads-up race against a vastly superior driver was okay. lol

It must be understood that going against even a slightly faster driver in a heads-up race is foolish to do and that you need compensation for there to be a fair race. You need to ask for a headstart and/or P.I..

The random pairings are rarely between equals. This means that a heads-up race should be rare. There is also added risk to a heads-up race if you lose. Losing a heads-up race will cost you -2pts while losing in a handicap race gains you 0.5pts. That's a big difference you don't want to risk unless you know you can win.

For the fast guys, they will gladly race you heads-up and without a handicap, because they know they will win every time and gain 3pts instead of 2pts. They might even try to con you into doing a heads-up race. But don't do it!

Slower drivers should always ask for a headstart and/or P.I. or it won't be fair, it won't be close racing, and it won't be fun.

Good luck this week @ Suzuka West P.I. C475

by **IFCA GTDon** Tue Nov 17, 2020 8:00 am

While looking at the cars that the drivers picked as their best hope for a win, it was interesting to see almost no one picked the same car. Everyone aside from Zach and D1mien's 1960 Corvette picked different cars.

The fact that Zach and D1mien collaborated on the same car and both won their matches, tells you that clubs/teams are more effective at this than individuals. It tells you and shows you that getting with a buddy to work out a car selection and build is a positive net gain every time. Two heads are better than one is the point.

It is for this very reason that this format was originally setup for club competition. The power in numbers makes a big difference in how good your car will be. With an entire club working on picking the best car and build and tune, your odds of being more competitive grow by leaps and bounds.

It behooves everyone to saddle up with a buddy and refine your car selection as long as it isn't the guy you're up against. Perhaps in the future, we can expand the format and make it a club level event as it was originally intended. Sort of depends on how good or bad FM8 is in the spring.

by **IFCA GTDon** Tue Nov 17, 2020 1:57 pm

IFCA Series News - Page 22 294dec4570d1a9a26037fec16a4f63fc

Recently I was practically accosted by a long-time critic of the IFCA when I called him out with an invite to race. I knew beforehand that he would not compete for a variety of tired old reasons but I offered it anyway. I did this to show I'm open and unafraid to compete anywhere any time in anything. To demonstrate that even though you may not like me and I may not like you, this isn't enough to prevent me from racing against you. In fact, it may be even more reason to race. It's also a way to prove that I have no hard feelings for anyone and am happy to let racing be the dominant subject over personality conflicts and differences of opinion.

This person who we will simply call Gomer Pyle had a long laundry list of complaints about me and the IFCA. And while they were all entirely unfounded and biased, it occurred to me that a few people could get the wrong idea from this misguided Gomer. So allow me to address every point here for all to read and understand.

As I go through the list Gomer presented I couldn't help but notice a thick thread running through all of it that shouted jealousy and envy. Why Gomer is this way is anybody's guess but it is usually rooted in some sort of deep-seated narcissism.

Gomer: "Your rating system is flawed"

GTDon2: "Not the first time I've heard this and always from some Gomer who knows nothing about rating formulas and doesn't have a formula themselves. It's easy to say something is wrong but another to prove it. Hard to do when you have no idea what you are talking about when it comes to rating formulas.

People assume that this is an arbitrary formula that I simply made up. It's not. It is a very well known Elo formula slightly modified for group ratings and works perfectly well. It's very accurate in most cases as has been proven for years now. It is self-correcting which is why we can get away with using it for team races. Eventually, the inflated or deflated ratings settle back down to normal after only a few singles races.

Proof of accuracy is that on average a driver rated in the 2000s is going to win more races against a driver in the 1990s. Not that the higher rated driver is always going to win but that he will win more often. And this is what you want from an accurate formula. The Elo formula is 60 years old now and well-proven in a variety of sports. It happens to be the same formula used at iRacing and organized chess.

Gomer: "You talk down to people and think you are all-knowing, the patron saint of sim-racing. Whenever people criticize you, instead of taking it, you dismiss them."

GTDon2: "Everyone at the IFCA knows that I am the "Benevolent Dictator" and not a sim-racing saint. lol Most know that this is humor and tongue-in-cheek because someone has to be the leader. Everyone also knows that I listen to everyone because that's what a benevolent dictator does. lol Just because I don't act or can't do some changes people ask for doesn't mean I'm being dismissive. Many things are changed because of the input people offer. Just not everything. The IFCA doesn't run like other leagues where there are a lot of arguments and politics and basically way too many cooks in the kitchen, and too many chiefs and not enough braves like at TORA and SimR.

Gomer: "You say you want to promote other leagues but that is BS you just like to control things and put other leagues down every chance you get."

GTDon: "What's good for the goose is good for the gander. If you want to criticize me and the IFCA then expect some criticism right back at you. I have always been in favor of cross over events to promote Forza sim-racing. This is why I have rated drivers in other leagues. It's the people in other leagues who do nothing to promote sim-racing outside their own little bubble. People who rarely if ever race outside of their home league are the pussies who accuse me of this and it's just ridiculous. I'm about the only one who doesn't think his home league is the end all and be all of Forza sim-racing. Meanwhile, everyone else thinks the only good legit league is their home league. Give me a break!"

Gomer: "Your relay race format didn't work, was too complicated, wasn't fun, and made no sense, just a hot lap race."

GTDon: "Actually it worked well for about 2 years and 13 seasons Gomer. And it was the only true team event that was being offered by any league anywhere outside of iRacing."

Gomer: "Who the hell are you GTDon? Most of Forza doesn't even know you. And you give dictators a bad name."

GTDon: "It's true most in Forza don't know me (or the IFCA) even though I was a published author for the official T10 FM3 guide. But that still makes me more well known than you Gomer. Forza has a huge fan base much larger than people realize. League racing and racers comprise but a small fraction of the total. Obviously Gomer you are revealing your jealousy here.

To be totally honest and to use an over used phrase, 'I'm not gonna lie', I do this hobby for fun. For my personal fun and Xbox entertainment almost exclusively. Otherwise, why do it, right? This means everything that is done here at the IFCA is mostly out of my own desire and creativity to have fun in ways not available anywhere else. Like it or not, the IFCA marches to a different drummer and supports other leagues, and welcomes all competitors. So stop pretending your league is the greatest. Stop pretending your league is without drama and faultless. Stop pretending you know me or what I do or don't do. But most of all Gomer, stop being a hater, please.

by **IFCA GTDon** Sat Nov 28, 2020 11:59 am

As some of you know by now Horizon 5 which is a more popular franchise than Forza at this point, is poised to be released even before FM8 sometime in the spring. This unfortunately means that we have an even longer wait for the next Forza. Because of this, the IFCA will be planning a new series based on recent feedback. The new series will be a more traditional single driver non-team event with a more open build while still taking into account the different driver skills for fairness.

The new series will be called the "Forza Masters" series. It will be a series that intends to open things up so that more aspects of selecting your own car, build, and tune can come into play.

The idea is that since we are all familiar with Forza at a high level we should be allowed to formulate our own creative idea of what works best for us. Each week of the 4 week season we will select a different category or group of cars from which to draw from. The idea here is that people don't always like a certain type of car and won't be stuck in a car type they don't like. So, every week will be a new experience and a new chance to win.

Car restrictions and further race details will be posted soon.

by **papa creech172** Sat Nov 28, 2020 5:24 pm

IFCA Series News - Page 22 Images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQeeepNytPbOmZAOeTcy0u4r2TJypJZjt7F_A&usqp=CAU

i am in

by **IFCA GTDon** Sat Nov 28, 2020 6:03 pm

papa creech172 wrote: i am in

lol nice, Goober. lol

by **IFCA GTDon** Mon Nov 30, 2020 12:50 pm

https://ifca.forumotion.com/t6697-ifca-grudge-match-race-results#137962

by **IFCA GTDon** Tue Dec 01, 2020 10:27 am

https://ifca.forumotion.com/t6699-ifca-forza-masters

by **IFCA GTDon** Wed Dec 02, 2020 12:28 pm

Wed Forza Masters
https://ifca.forumotion.com/t6616p100-wednesday-night-trans-am-support-races#137968

by **IFCA GTDon** Thu Dec 10, 2020 12:14 pm

GTDon2 wrote:Wed Forza Masters
https://ifca.forumotion.com/t6616p100-wednesday-night-trans-am-support-races#137968

If you haven't participated in our Forza Masters series or you know someone who might want to partake in this original but traditional format, tell them to show up Wed night for our practice fun run.

There's a lot of appeal to a series where you get to build a competitive car your own way. The only restrictions within a selected Division is to use the widest race tires, stock wheels, and no downforce. For the velocity challenged (read slower drivers) you are permitted the use of downforce and any wheel combination.

Many of our drivers are sharing their builds as well. Some drivers are more challenged by having to figure out a good build and tune is why.

The whole idea of this series is to put your entire Forza knowledge to the test in an open build scenario. To allow the drivers to decide what is best for them while at the same time providing equalizing limits for everyone.

Each selected Division per week has a limited number of cars to investigate which is great because it makes narrowing down your best car a lot easier than if an entire Class was used. The limitations really help mitigate leaderboard cars too. What you end up with is a kind of sub-class of cars not normally used thus refreshing the lineup.

So let your friends know and we will see you Wed nights at 9pm EST.

by **IFCA GTDon** Mon Dec 14, 2020 10:43 am

IFCA Series News - Page 22 Forza-motorsport-8-release-date

Of course, it isn't called "Forza 8" as you all know, it is called "Forza Motorsport." But just as we who play the game don't say "Fortsa" but rather "Forzza," we all know it really is Forza 8.

Release date rumors are still suggesting February which flys in the face of recent Forza Horizon 5 rumors being released BEFORE FM8. So who knows. Below is a list of changes we can look forward to seeing however.

Here's what the new game is rumored to bring to it:

New tire pressure model
Dynamic track temperatures
New atmosphere pressure system, affecting air density, dynamics and power
Redesigned suspension system with ned modeling
New ranked online system
New integrated online Ghosting System
Tracks have full day and night cycles depending on race length/track
Rubber in on tracks
New heat interaction with tire pressure
Expanded race capacity
Off-road racing on land or gravel
Rally races will also be present
Clubs Return

by EZT TomCat7 Mon Dec 14, 2020 11:37 am

New atmosphere pressure system, affecting air density, dynamics and power!

Sounds good. cheers

Does that mean that "Drafting" will actually work? lol!

by **IFCA GTDon** Sat Jan 02, 2021 12:56 pm

IFCA Series News - Page 22 2018-Super-Gt-drivers

Hey everybody, if you know of a few guys who want to race, Wed night's fun run is perfect for this. It will let them try out our Forza Masters format just for fun to see if they might like to enter the real deal on Saturdays.

Also, try reconnecting with some guys that we haven't seen for a while. They might like this new format a lot better and join back up.

Personally, I've had a lot of new fun exploring cars I've rarely driven if at all, and then building and tuning them. It's really testing my Forza knowledge and I'm actually learning some new tricks too!

So yeah, spread the word, and let's get some new guys out here on the track with us!

by **IFCA GTDon** Sun Jan 03, 2021 1:24 pm

I just stumbled upon this old article from 10 years ago and was reminded that it was one of the reasons I was dismissed as a T10 Mod and eventually banned for life. Justified? You be the judge. It's a real trip down memory lane.

From franchise to gaming dynasty

Posted by GTDon on February 21, 2010

So, what does it take to go from a hit racing simulation, to a franchise, to a dynasty? In a word, "vision." Making a video game into a hit simulator is hard enough. Taking a one-hit wonder and making it a franchise, even harder still. Going from solid franchise to an era-leading dynasty within the genre becomes extremely difficult for any game, simulation or not.

Ultimately it is the vision of the creator that will dictate the direction and line a game follows. Initially the creative idea is fundamentally simple and straight forward in nature. E.g., create a car racing game that imparts a sense of reality. From there it goes to, how much reality should one impart?

Flight simulators for example, such as the, "Microsoft Flight Simulator" franchise dynasty, are at the extreme end of simulation technology entertainment, and as such are less entertaining than they are instructionally interesting. To their credit they have stayed the course pursuing simulation perfection since about 1982.

As focused, long lasting, and strong as their vision was for their award winning product, it still became a victim of, "management issues and delays in project delivery combined with increased demands in headcount, at a time that Microsoft was attempting to lower costs." Sadly, the "Microsoft Flight Simulator" team "ACES" was laid off in two thousand nine.
Were they a failure? Not at all, especially when you consider their longevity in the industry. In fact, they were the most successful flight simulator of the video gaming industry ever. Today's automotive simulation counterparts would love to have a nearly 30 year run of success such as this.

Still, there is a lesson to be learned from what happened to "ACES." It would appear that, "management issues and delays in project delivery" can root out even the most successful titles. We see this same malignant issue in the two leading racing simulation franchises of, Microsoft's "Turn 10's" Forza Motorsports, and Sony's "Polyphony Digital's" Gran Turismo, today.

Polyphony has become the butt of delay jokes in the industry. In the same period of time that Turn 10 has released Forza 1, 2, and 3, Polyphony has yet to release its successor to the two thousand five hit "Gran Turismo 4" sequel. (Please don't mention, "Prologue.")
Not to be out done, Turn 10 has been highly criticized for the opposite problem of prematurely releasing each of its sequels, as noted by the plethora of minor programming glitches and incomplete admissions stated in various interviews.

In the case of Polyphony Digital it has long since been argued that the president and creator of Gran Turismo, Kazunori Yamauchi, is simply a fanatical perfectionist in the same spirit of the most patient master samurai sword smiths. He refuses to birth his next creation until his vision of the game is fully and completely realized. The problem with this strategy (or is it a fetish?) is that the longer one waits to perfect every iota of their game, the more, "Moore's Law" thwarts the effort.

Moore's law describes a long-term trend in the history of computing hardware, in which the number of transistors that can be placed inexpensively on an integrated circuit has doubled approximately every two years. That means that computing power has quadrupled during the years GT5 has been under construction. Is it any wonder then that Kazunori Yamauchi never catches the carrot on his stick? Every time he thinks he has everything in place, technology offers yet another advance that he wants to exploit.

The result of this chasing after your technological tail is delay after delay to the point that you leave the door open for your competitors to try to step in and steal your hard won market share, and rabid fan base. Enter Forza Motorsports. To date, the release of GT5 is still only rumored to be any time between March, and July two thousand ten, but no one is holding their breath.

The fascinating thing with Polyphony and Gran Turismo is that in spite of the numerous project delays and obvious single minded dictatorial management style, they appear to be poised to reclaim their once undisputed position, and in fact finally become the dynasty of the genre that everyone thought was a foregone conclusion five years ago. What accounts for this? Perhaps a dictator with a racing vision is more powerful, than a democracy of driving ideas.

The main theme or point of Gran Turismo has been very constant over the years. It's all about racing perfectly simulated cars on a level that impresses everyone from casual gamer to car racing fan. There has always been something extra special, extra "sweet" about the content and flavor of a Gran Turismo game. The presentation has a legendary or mythical-like quality that many attractive RPG games would do well to capture. Gran Turismo as a major in-house Sony Playstation title is famous for setting the new benchmark in gaming entertainment. Polyphony's influence has been so great that dozens of racing games were inspired by it, not the least of which was Forza Motorsports.

Dan Greenawalt, the curator and head of "Turn 10" was very impressed by the first Gran Turismo, and like so many of us wanted more. He set out to create his own unique version of the game with some added features like the wildly popular in-game painting application. With major support from Microsoft Studios it was easy to see that Forza Motorsports would become a chief competing title.

Greenawalt's vision was generally the same as Yamauchi's at first, but with expanded features not found in Gran Turismo. Over time and subsequent sequels, those extra features were so well received that they became equal in importance or greater than any other aspect of the game, including racing.

As the Turn 10 team grew, departmental democracy took hold, twisting and warping the original vision into something arguably more than a driving or racing simulator. With more people and more sub-teams handling the immense Forza 3 project in an effort to better manage the work load, and get the product on the shelves, you see an indistinct homogeny of features designed to attract the attention of dissimilar interests, all under one guise. This broad one size fits all approach allows artists, painters, photographers, filmographers, buyers, sellers, drifters, and oh, almost forgot, racers, to cross each others paths in the same game.

While each new version of Gran Turismo strikes one as being revolutionary, each new version of Forza falls on the less dramatic side of, evolutionary. With Forza the basic game play, physics, and sequenced interface is mostly unchanged once you look past the revised graphical facades. The look is different with each new version, but the underpinnings for how the cars behave and are manipulated, have barely changed.

The feeling is that aside from some minor enhancements to the physics engine, and the performance indexing, Turn 10 has tried to keep a, "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" approach to car building, tuning, and performance. Going even further to try to appeal to a still broader casual gaming audience, Turn 10 created and adopted certain options, features, and functions, to make the game easier to gain access to, so the uninitiated can be more quickly immersed. All laudable choices and sincere aims no doubt, but through it all the original vision has been clouded somewhat, and possibly even lost or discarded. Helping to add to this opinion, is the inconsistent application of the, "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" mantra when it comes to the latest multiplayer match making hopper system of FM3. The ability to freely associate with random players of a like mind through the use of player host controlled lobbies of FM2, were deleted for FM3. In its place is a more automated hopper system intended to make it easier and friendlier for the casual player to experience.

Unfortunately, the exact opposite response Turn 10 desired occurred, resulting in less players playing, while acting with greater anonymity, and less socializing. FM3 lobbies compared to FM2 lobbies are mostly silent crash fests with fewer people using microphones.

A great uproar on the FM.net forum erupted to produce some of the largest most angry thread posts ever seen in fan protest of any game. The powers that be at Turn 10 reluctantly and infrequently responded with what the fans thought was a casual indifference at best, and down right hostility at worst.

At first Turn 10 tried to solicit the help of community leaders to extinguish the flames, but the tsunami of fire was already too great. The fans, especially the core fan base felt a sense of betrayal on all fronts. They saw a repeating pattern from Turn 10 of over hyping the newest game release, being silent on fundamental changes to the game prior to release, ignoring the pleas for correction, and the core fan base being marginalized for being too passionate.
It didn't help that many of the same old game issues reared their ugly heads at the same time, such as the engine swap money glitch. Worse still was that if you used this glitch-dev secret, Turn 10 was going to delete your account, something they did not do in FM2. Add to this a long list of glitch-cheater cars and parts swaps ruining the integrity of the leader boards, and you get the distinct impression that the game was hardly beta tested, but rather, thrown on the retail shelves as fast as possible in a bad economy for a company needing cash.

Above and beyond all of these acerbic things was a noticeably suspicious lack of simulation racing emphasis to the franchise. Forza had become a pseudo-simulator in which its creator openly admitted that he saw less and less of a meaningful reason to draw a distinction between what was an arcade racer and a simulator.

The once uncompromising fans of Gran Turismo who were lured away by Turn 10 because of the huge delay between GT4 and GT5, have watched Forza go down a different road than what originally attracted them to simulation racing in the first place, and that is, to simulation race. These same GT fans embraced the then upstart Forza 1 wholeheartedly, and became the hardcore base of the Forza franchise. This core fan base gave Turn 10 the respect and dollars they needed to continue the franchise's sequels, in their (Turn 10's) non-stop march to supplant any and all other racing simulators including Gran Turismo, as a dynasty in the genre.

But low and behold, the fact is the Forza franchise has taken a turn away from the single minded Gran Turismo emphasis on racing, and yet has successfully branched off into a more open field of dreams. But at what cost? Is it worth losing the core fan base that made the franchise possible? Has Forza grown enough to succeed as a dynasty on mass appeal alone? The answer will have to wait, but if the recent actions of Turn 10 are any indication the wait is already over.

Recently Turn 10 deleted, removed, and rearranged the thousands of feedback posts characterizing their new multiplayer system as being an unpopular flop. They also removed any negative references or opinions on how they have handled the situation, and added a warning to those who might persist. At the same time many have left the forum and game in protest. These are not signs of a burgeoning dynasty my friends.

It can be fairly argued that fan appreciation is at an all time low for Turn 10, odd considering its recent release of FM3. But the spin is, the greater Forza community is what's important, not the hardcore minority base who frequent the forums.

Of course this schism comes at an opportune time for the folks at Polyphony Digital who have already been ramping up pre GT5 events with time trials, and turning simulation racers into real racers. Though neither franchise has actually become the simulation racing dynasty they were hoped to be for reasons of management style, and project delays-development, could it be that the once wayward brethren and prodigal sons, who left GT to follow Forza, will now return to make the difference?

With Sony discounting its PS3 price to Xbox 360 levels, will it be enough to entice this shunned hardcore fan base to return home to a more focused console simulation racing experience? Will FM4 be just one more step removed from simulation racing towards a broader based game generating greater sales figures than before, even without the self-important hardcore users? Or will a third party arrive on the scene to create what probably should have been done by now, produce an incomparable console racing simulator without rival and with lasting dynastic value.

Full throttle,
AAR GTDon

by **IFCA GTDon** Mon Jan 25, 2021 4:18 pm

IFCA Series News - Page 22 11047C7530E040C597C08F813BDA7DA4

As we seem to be attracting more and more drivers as of late because of the new Forza Masters format which is a simpler more straightforward format, there could come a time when we must use a sign-up sheet. The reason why the IFCA has seldom used a sign-up sheet is to make joining a race/series easier and quicker. The other reason is that we didn't want the extra work or step. A lot of people will sign-up with zero intention to race more than the opening round if that. You end up with about 25% who never race as a result. This is bad because you adjust the format to accommodate more people but then they are a no-show. That's adding wasted time and effort no one likes. It also produces unequal lobbies.

In recent times with the Trans-Am Relay series, we required everyone to qualify to get into the race as a substitute for a sign-up. And it worked fairly well. It committed people to race essentially. We always had enough room and no one didn't make it in.

In the future, we've decided that we will do something similar. Instead of a straight-up qualifier for everyone which has the potential to block slower drivers from getting in, only Silver and above drivers will be forced to qualify. Bronze level drivers and below, up to 10 drivers, will get a free pass and will not be required to qualify to get into the season. If there are more than 10 Bronze level drivers the highest rated of those remaining Bronze level drivers would have to qualify to get in.

The reason for this is that we don't have 2 lobbies of 24 drivers each. We might only have a max of 24 drivers in 1 lobby. The point is, without nearly 50 drivers, and 2 full lobbies, it isn't that fun. What you'll end up with is 1 full fun lobby and 1 half full not so fun lobby.

If we are going to barely have slightly more than 24 drivers then it makes easy sense to allow their skill to determine whether or not they should get into an IFCA race. And since the IFCA has always been about the little guy, the grassroots enthusiast of the hobby, it also makes sense to favor the slower drivers and give them a free pass. In this way, the slower drivers need not feel depressed that they will be locked out by faster drivers. In fact, just the opposite, they will be automatically locked in. Only the faster drivers will have to work their way in. This limits the fast guys to just 14 grid slots too. Sound fair? lol

Again this is based on the idea that we reach beyond the 24 driver, 1 lobby threshold. I'm not sure if we will need to go this route for Season 3 of the Forza Masters yet. But at least you know that we have thought about what to do if we have to.

by **IFCA GTDon** Sat Feb 06, 2021 10:37 pm

ROSCOE posted this in our Season 3 Forza Masters thread and I wanted to get more appropriate exposure here. ROSCOE is a very good driver who has mastered the control of his cars at a high level. His game clips are just the sort of thing we try to avoid here at the IFCA.

Things are a bit more friendlier here than in many other places when it comes to contact. Other leagues expect you to go hard/play hard and don't call it a foul when you blast someone off the track. They expect it, or they simply don't rule on it and call it "just racing."

I implore all of you to race like your car and lives are worth something, and don't drive over your head and don't make risky or dangerous passes. If you can't pass clean here at the IFCA you better have very light contact at the most, or you will be penalized.

Here, 'rubbins racin' but we do only mean rubbing and precious little more. We aren't in a racing version of a shooter game. We aren't trying to kill anyone. We are trying to race close and clean with a sense of mutual trust and what's fair for the fun to take place. Nobody likes getting cheated out of a position through uncalled for contact.

IFCA Series News - Page 22 Empty

by ROSCOEpCOTRAIN Yesterday at 8:33 pm

https://clips.twitch.tv/ShakingStrongHeronTBCheesePull
https://clips.twitch.tv/IncredulousFamousNuggetsHassaanChop
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